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Does God have a language?

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  • rudemonk
    replied
    Re: Does God have a language?

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: More4us</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: monk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">it's kind of weird isn't it, I was watching this show on elephants yesterday, and they apparently have a language of sorts as well...somehow a group of elephants must have all sort of agreed if you will, that this one tonal rumble meant let's go find water, or...here is a tree with nuts, began mimicking each other and I guess that is how it is set...and then passed down through the clans.

    Even how they communicated one to another to rescue a calf from a mud pit, they both worked in tandem and systematically, while another dug a ramp out of the pit for the calf once he was freed... </div></div>

    What about dolphins?
    Chimps?
    Whales?
    </div></div>

    My friend has a parrot. It has a vocab of over 400 words at least. I would swear it's speaking is NOT random, nor simply mimicking.

    I alway thought it would be cool to be able to sign language with an ape. That must be insane.

    Leave a comment:


  • Morpheous
    replied
    Re: Does God have a language?

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: monk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">it's kind of weird isn't it, I was watching this show on elephants yesterday, and they apparently have a language of sorts as well...somehow a group of elephants must have all sort of agreed if you will, that this one tonal rumble meant let's go find water, or...here is a tree with nuts, began mimicking each other and I guess that is how it is set...and then passed down through the clans.

    Even how they communicated one to another to rescue a calf from a mud pit, they both worked in tandem and systematically, while another dug a ramp out of the pit for the calf once he was freed... </div></div>

    What about dolphins?
    Chimps?
    Whales?

    Leave a comment:


  • f0rTyLeGz
    replied
    Re: Does God have a language?

    That stuff blows me away. I recall a documentary about elephants where an elephant comes across the skeleton of another elephant, that he knew, that has been slaughtered for it's tusks. The elephant carefully gathered the scattered bones and brought them together.

    To me that video said so much about memory, and conversation in the mind of the elephant. Googleing around I found this little reference... http://www.elephantfriends.org/mind.html

    Leave a comment:


  • rudemonk
    replied
    Re: Does God have a language?

    it's kind of weird isn't it, I was watching this show on elephants yesterday, and they apparently have a language of sorts as well...somehow a group of elephants must have all sort of agreed if you will, that this one tonal rumble meant let's go find water, or...here is a tree with nuts, began mimicking each other and I guess that is how it is set...and then passed down through the clans.

    Even how they communicated one to another to rescue a calf from a mud pit, they both worked in tandem and systematically, while another dug a ramp out of the pit for the calf once he was freed...

    Leave a comment:


  • f0rTyLeGz
    replied
    Re: Does God have a language?

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: monk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">hey 40...are you a fan of NPR by any chance?

    there is going to be a show on languages that are on the verge of extinction which I thought you would find fascinating.

    also found this on the site:

    http://www.npr.org/templates/story/s...oryId=14537549
    </div></div>
    I am a fan of NPR, but I missed this story... thanks.

    There is a wonderful novel called Riddley Walker written by Russel Hoban. It's a post Apocalypse novel, and Mr. Hoban makes up a new language that the reader must get their head around. link

    Leave a comment:


  • f0rTyLeGz
    replied
    Re: Does God have a language?

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: monk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">well, in art school we were taught to sometimes stop thinking in any modality other than visual.</div></div>
    Just had a flashback to an bit of a story about alchemy, and how you made lead to gold was to stir molten lead while not thinking of the word rhinoceros.

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: monk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
    in some meditative states in ch'an buddhism, you attain a kind of mental state in which thoughts sort of flutter out...you are left just being. I've only hit that a few times it is called 'no-mind.'</div></div>
    For sure meditation has some real effects. I recall a few years ago there was a spate of news reports (link) about gamma brain waves and lasting benefits of meditation.

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: monk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
    but clearly the mind is active, if we grew up with no language we would still have higher cognitive function...perhaps you are right and we need some new words.</div></div>
    Well, we have many fascinating stories of feral people. They get along after a fashion, and always imitate in a general way the animals that helped them make it through those vulnerable years, but they never really &quot;get&quot; language. And then there is Helen Keller, who did get language.

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: monk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
    animal 'languages' and signs had to evolve and grow from smaller beginnings...genetics apparently have a bit to do with this as well, as scientists have manipulated some genes in finches which render their noises unintelligible to other finches, so one has to wonder how exactly did they gain their 'languages.' </div></div>
    There's got to be some &quot;urge to imitate&quot; the latest meme that is passing through the community that we eventually organize... er something?

    Leave a comment:


  • Morpheous
    replied
    Re: Does God have a language?

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sukuna</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: More4us</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
    LOL. God said and I quote from the bible &quot;let there be light&quot;... and there was light etc. so God had to have spoken a language for humans since creation to undertand what he said?? Isn't it?
    I wonder who/what God was talking to/with?
    Himself? </div></div>
    I do not think it was literally meant. The fact is the power come from the word. Hence, in the name of Jesus, just the name.
    Light had to be named for it to &quot;be&quot;, God had to be name for him to be. He is the head of the hierarchy. Humans had to have a language to create God to create Light. I also believe that nothingness is the head of the hierachy otherwise it is impossible to logically explain any Thing.

    Ask modern* science how light was created. Sometimes I find it dumb to take the purely physical route to explain everything.
    But ask an obeah man to create light, what will he do? na chant light? God was talking to light and whatever he was creating </div></div>
    I was merely playing devil's advocate. It was not meant literally. The guys down here are used to how I put my points across. However your comment on god talking to light is funny.

    Leave a comment:


  • rudemonk
    replied
    Re: Does God have a language?

    hey 40...are you a fan of NPR by any chance?

    there is going to be a show on languages that are on the verge of extinction which I thought you would find fascinating.

    also found this on the site:

    http://www.npr.org/templates/story/s...oryId=14537549

    Leave a comment:


  • rudemonk
    replied
    Re: Does God have a language?

    do dreams roll out in language and are dreams thinking, or do we translate the visuals into language after the fact when we are consciously attempting to grip with them...

    Leave a comment:


  • rudemonk
    replied
    Re: Does God have a language?

    well, in art school we were taught to sometimes stop thinking in any modality other than visual.

    in some meditative states in ch'an buddhism, you attain a kind of mental state in which thoughts sort of flutter out...you are left just being. I've only hit that a few times it is called 'no-mind.'

    but clearly the mind is active, if we grew up with no language we would still have higher cognitive function...perhaps you are right and we need some new words.

    animal 'languages' and signs had to evolve and grow from smaller beginnings...genetics apparently have a bit to do with this as well, as scientists have manipulated some genes in finches which render their noises unintelligible to other finches, so one has to wonder how exactly did they gain their 'languages.'

    Leave a comment:


  • f0rTyLeGz
    replied
    Re: Does God have a language?

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: monk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">what is your opinion about apes who can sign, 40?</div></div>
    Are you referring to this recent news? Link ?

    I believe that apes have many signs for sure. And probably apes and birds and whales have signs and calls or whistles that are passed on from generation to generation. What differs with humans, I think, is that many of our languages are expanding, and growing...and, we are able to pass this now enormous learning on to some members of the next generation. Other animals that &quot;have language&quot; can't do this.

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: monk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
    also, before we were conditioned linguistically, we certainly thought. </div></div>

    I'm not sure what you mean here? Do you mean that when &quot;we were&quot; Australopithecus three million years ago? Or, do you mean when &quot;we were&quot; newborn infants?

    I guess I think that words like &quot;thought&quot; and &quot;thinking&quot;, and &quot;conscious,&quot; and &quot;intelligent,&quot; are limiting. We need some new words.

    Recently in a post Dr Dudd states how he enjoys just thinking .... Link. There was a famous parrot that died at 31 Link who had a tremendous vocabulary. But I don't think that the parrot used those words to &quot;think&quot; about things. Plus, the parrot could never teach those words it knows to another parrot.

    Are newborn babies thinking? I don't think so. I figure that there are sounds and colors and feelings and scents that are hitting their senses, and at some critical point the sounds that parents and caretakers are making, start connecting with the infants sensory experiences. The baby hears it's own sounds, and this mimicking + organizing + naming language thing takes off. It takes several years, and humans are very vulnerable for these years, while this language ability grows.

    To my way of thinking, thoughts imply words. I would enjoy hearing your ideas on thinking before we are linguistically conditioned?

    Leave a comment:


  • rudemonk
    replied
    Re: Does God have a language?

    what is your opinion about apes who can sign, 40?

    also, before we were conditioned linguistically, we certainly thought.

    Leave a comment:


  • H_O
    replied
    Re: Does God have a language?

    yep. he does. its called BS.

    Leave a comment:


  • rufian
    replied
    Re: Does God have a language?

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: f0rTyLeGz</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sukuna</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I believe that we created God and not the other way around. Therefore he is so powerful to be able to speak every single language on earth so long as that language supports him. He speaks through signs, events, appearances like angels which alone suggest body language. Handwritting appear on walls and everything that a human can conceive is the work of God.

    In other words, if in a language the word &quot;God&quot; does not exist, there is no God.

    </div></div>
    I agree, language &quot;creates&quot; God, or gods, by naming him or them, or her. And great point that once they are named, then they &quot;exist&quot; until the language dies. That's positively liberating.

    Haven't we all been a little spooked by the constant &quot;voice&quot; in our minds?

    Plus, when we are talking there is usually someone who we are talking to. So if, like you suggest, that once we create God in our language, we use his power to answer many questions. I think that many of us, especially in the past, felt like, imagined, that that voice in their head, was &quot;speaking&quot; to God? God can &quot;hear&quot; that voice? </div></div>
    Well it is said that he knows all, it is even said that he speak through that voice, he and the devil of course. That voice is from self which determines him so it is one common source. Does it matters if sound is made? When I am thinking, I am hearing things when I am speaking I am saying things. You see what language can do? What is the difference?
    We tend only to take responsibilities for our thoughts when others hear them. When I think in my head, that is not me it is that little voice or even God

    Leave a comment:


  • rufian
    replied
    Re: Does God have a language?

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: More4us</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: f0rTyLeGz</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What can we say about an intelligent designer (or a god who created us)? We can't say that the designer had to have a head and arms, and an opposing thumb, but we can say that a designer needed words... can't we? No being can design without words. Well, not unless all of this is the creation of a designed robot. But whoever designed the first designing robot had to have a language I would suggest.

    A language must be learned from others. Languages evolve, and an intelligent designer of our world would have to be the product of a language more sophisticated than ours is at this time.

    Is it logical to give an intelligent designer these attributes? Could an intelligent designer be intelligent without language? </div></div>
    LOL. God said and I quote from the bible &quot;let there be light&quot;... and there was light etc. so God had to have spoken a language for humans since creation to undertand what he said?? Isn't it?
    I wonder who/what God was talking to/with?
    Himself? </div></div>
    I do not think it was literally meant. The fact is the power come from the word. Hence, in the name of Jesus, just the name.
    Light had to be named for it to &quot;be&quot;, God had to be name for him to be. He is the head of the hierarchy. Humans had to have a language to create God to create Light. I also believe that nothingness is the head of the hierachy otherwise it is impossible to logically explain any Thing.

    Ask modern* science how light was created. Sometimes I find it dumb to take the purely physical route to explain everything.
    But ask an obeah man to create light, what will he do? na chant light? God was talking to light and whatever he was creating

    Leave a comment:

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