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Questions for the christians

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  • neutral
    replied
    Re: Questions for the christians

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: heretic</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Newtriment</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: PDB_Again</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

    Arite Papa - back to regular programmin den. </div></div>

    I thought you had &quot;done yahso&quot; at leat 3 pages ago,..you just couldnt resist could you,.....you had to do your &quot;christian&quot; thing and return to have the last word in the form of sarcasm,how petty and smallminded of you....it bettah yu did juss lef it papa.

    </div></div>Stop persecute di man. Why yu keep draggin him in here? </div></div>

    Lol,..he`s got to keep coming back to say that he`s done with this.

    Leave a comment:


  • heretic
    replied
    Re: Questions for the christians

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Newtriment</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: PDB_Again</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

    Arite Papa - back to regular programmin den. </div></div>

    I thought you had &quot;done yahso&quot; at leat 3 pages ago,..you just couldnt resist could you,.....you had to do your &quot;christian&quot; thing and return to have the last word in the form of sarcasm,how petty and smallminded of you....it bettah yu did juss lef it papa.

    </div></div>Stop persecute di man. Why yu keep draggin him in here?

    Leave a comment:


  • neutral
    replied
    Re: Questions for the christians

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: PDB_Again</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

    Arite Papa - back to regular programmin den. </div></div>

    I thought you had &quot;done yahso&quot; at leat 3 pages ago,..you just couldnt resist could you,.....you had to do your &quot;christian&quot; thing and return to have the last word in the form of sarcasm,how petty and smallminded of you....it bettah yu did juss lef it papa.

    Leave a comment:


  • rudemonk
    replied
    Re: Questions for the christians

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: CEW</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
    But how much of christianity have you personally studied to confirm the &quot;contradictions,irrationalities,and outward impossible feats&quot;, or are you simply content to repeat what you have heard? And what is a Biblical contradiction anyways? There are myriads of literature that addresses so-called contradictions, it's as if the people claiming them haven't read any of the apologetics. And just because something may seem irrational and outwardly impossible doesn't negate their factuality.
    </div></div>

    The entire premise of Creation is factually innaccurate, as depicted in the 2 creation stories of Genesis. We've gone through that before, and yet it still doesn't seem to matter that Paul dug around and made up a shoddy pastiche of a salvation model.

    Original Sin, for example, can not be acceptable if one starts from the premise that God is omniscient, all powerful, and omnibenificent, moral, ethical, and just.

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> One just need to consider the change in the life of one who genuinely accepts the Good News to see the transforming power of christian coversion on the physical, emotional, social, congnitive, volitional, spiritual, and other domains of personhood. It is only from the human perspective that we deem things irrational and outwardly impossible, and from that perspective I agree with you 100%.
    </div></div>

    excepting that you can find the same transformative powers in other religions, in other worthy pursuits which have nothing to do with Christianity or belief in God for that matter.

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
    The separation however comes when I take it one step further and look at those things from God's perspective. From there, nothing is impossible or irrational.
    </div></div>

    now CEW, you have admitted that we, being just poorly designed mortals, can not grasp God's perspective- at least when it becomes inconvenient or impossible to use it to satisfactorily explain what people using a pastiche book are trying to get people to believe in. How many times, when confronted with some piece of factual information which points out fallacious scriptural beliefs, do we see the religious shrug their shoulders and invoke God's mystery. It is far more convenient to shrug one's shoulders, plod on, than go and sell all that thou hast...

    Leave a comment:


  • WorshipRaiser
    replied
    Re: Questions for the christians

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Newtriment</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: PDB_Again</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

    Bredren, hear de setup. Either you believe or you don't. I happen to believe okay? I can't do a thing about your disbelief and there's nothing you can do about mine. I'm not gonna try to persuade you because you believe what you do. Therefore, nothing you say my friend can dissuade me from Christ. Alright. A done mi done yahso. Bless Up </div></div>

    There is nothing in my response that indicated that I wish to dissuade you from &quot;christ&quot;,......indeed how can I dissuade you from something I believe to be non existent.

    You obviously are somehow convinced you are right in what you believe in and are entrenched in that belief,likewise I too know I am right in what I do not believe in and will remain entrenched in not believing in a doctrine that was forced upon black people through slavery and subsequently brainwashed down through generations,,...its not about persuasion,...its a discussion about beliefs,...you are not under any obligation to participate in the discussion my friend,...the topic heading said &quot;questions for the christians&quot;,..not everyone that claim that they &quot;believe&quot; is a christian </div></div>

    Arite Papa - back to regular programmin den.

    Leave a comment:


  • Shine_Eye_Girl
    replied
    Re: Questions for the christians

    Whatever the religion may be......do you notice the one common being in them all?

    Served differently, but recognized the same....so all religions are just wrong then huh?

    I'm tired now.....

    Leave a comment:


  • H_O
    replied
    Re: Questions for the christians

    and here comes the part that &quot;its the devils work&quot;.

    like thats a possibility. so when i get this answer, im left to believe the god they believe in is (a) a coward and (b) and weak.

    so im left to believe that the word &quot;god&quot; means highest power.
    so therefore if its the devils work, then our devil is winning the battle.
    but then again, most people usually cheer on the underdog.
    as soon as we can rid this world of religion, the sooner we can all get along and stop fighting wars. because most wars are fought on the basis of religion. go figure.
    you figure if theres a god and there was, and there were proof-everyone would believe the same thing.
    but no, we got different religions and different beliefs and no one can agree.

    Leave a comment:


  • neutral
    replied
    Re: Questions for the christians

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TLC_30</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What amazes me is that how so many supposed intelligent people give man so much credit.

    Did deeper and think about where this all comes from.....come on do you really think man is responsible for all of this?

    The arrogance of man is responsible for his demise..... </div></div>

    TLC,...I am of the school that thinks that we are masters of our own destiny,the more insight we gain into how things work the more some will say &quot;look &quot;god&quot; is responsible&quot;,,..there is no higher power,no god,we are left to our own devices,yes man is arrogant,and the more knowledgeable we get the more arrogant we get,ultimately we may yet destroy ourselves but it wont be as a result of any gods.

    You`ve only got to look around you to see the destruction man wreaks on each other,the poverty,inequalities,how powerful rulers treat less powerful countries,...christians interpret every disaster as yet another proof that &quot;god is coming for his world&quot;....yet this so-called god never shows up,and man go on destroying each other, some in the name of these very gods.

    Leave a comment:


  • neutral
    replied
    Re: Questions for the christians

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: CEW</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
    But how much of christianity have you personally studied to confirm the &quot;contradictions,irrationalities,and outward impossible feats&quot;, or are you simply content to repeat what you have heard? And what is a Biblical contradiction anyways? There are myriads of literature that addresses so-called contradictions, it's as if the people claiming them haven't read any of the apologetics. And just because something may seem irrational and outwardly impossible doesn't negate their factuality. From the Christian perspective, we don't even have to use the Bible to find evidence of those things. One just need to consider the change in the life of one who genuinely accepts the Good News to see the transforming power of christian coversion on the physical, emotional, social, congnitive, volitional, spiritual, and other domains of personhood. It is only from the human perspective that we deem things irrational and outwardly impossible, and from that perspective I agree with you 100%. The separation however comes when I take it one step further and look at those things from God's perspective. From there, nothing is impossible or irrational.

    So in some ways, we're back to square one. While the unbeliever finds it incredulous that &quot;so many supposedly intelligent rational people in the world can embrace the concept ... of 'god'&quot;, the believer finds it just as incredulous, all things considered, that &quot;so many supposedly intelligent rational people in the world&quot; don't.

    </div></div>

    CEW,you are correct,I havent studied enough about christianity to confirm the contradictions etc,..I have however read enough on the subject to know that contradictions are rife,I could name numerous and you would come back with an answer for them,.the fact that contradictions can be explained away by yet another biblical passage doesnt make them any less of a contradiction.

    I have now come to the acceptance that its almost impossible for a non believer to discuss christianity with a believer and for either to gain any meaningful insight,an example of this is you looking at it &quot;from gods perspectives&quot;...a concept I can never comprehend based on my position and outlook on the whole argument.

    You say this...&quot;<span style="font-weight: bold"> One just need to consider the change in the life of one who genuinely accepts the Good News to see the transforming power of christian coversion on the physical, emotional, social, congnitive, volitional, spiritual, and other domains of personhood.</span>&quot;

    Those changes are not limited to just people who &quot;accept the good news&quot;,...non believers are also perceptible to those very changes to their personhood,...and trust me,I`ve seen some pretty miserable people who have also claimed to have accept the good news.

    As you rightly say though,we are back to square one,..each incredulous of the others position......LOl !

    Thanks for a good discussion mate.

    Leave a comment:


  • Shine_Eye_Girl
    replied
    Re: Questions for the christians

    What amazes me is that how so many supposed intelligent people give man so much credit.

    Did deeper and think about where this all comes from.....come on do you really think man is responsible for all of this?

    The arrogance of man is responsible for his demise.....

    Leave a comment:


  • Diplomat
    replied
    Re: Questions for the christians

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It still amazes me how so many supposedly intelligent rational people in the world can embrace the concept of heaven or hell,or a &quot;god&quot;,and all the other stuff that comes with the bible and christianity,it just seems crazy that people are prepared to believe so much contradictions, irrationalities, and outward impossible feats,...based on &quot;faith&quot; of the unknown.</div></div>
    But how much of christianity have you personally studied to confirm the &quot;contradictions,irrationalities,and outward impossible feats&quot;, or are you simply content to repeat what you have heard? And what is a Biblical contradiction anyways? There are myriads of literature that addresses so-called contradictions, it's as if the people claiming them haven't read any of the apologetics. And just because something may seem irrational and outwardly impossible doesn't negate their factuality. From the Christian perspective, we don't even have to use the Bible to find evidence of those things. One just need to consider the change in the life of one who genuinely accepts the Good News to see the transforming power of christian coversion on the physical, emotional, social, congnitive, volitional, spiritual, and other domains of personhood. It is only from the human perspective that we deem things irrational and outwardly impossible, and from that perspective I agree with you 100%. The separation however comes when I take it one step further and look at those things from God's perspective. From there, nothing is impossible or irrational.

    So in some ways, we're back to square one. While the unbeliever finds it incredulous that &quot;so many supposedly intelligent rational people in the world can embrace the concept ... of 'god'&quot;, the believer finds it just as incredulous, all things considered, that &quot;so many supposedly intelligent rational people in the world&quot; don't.

    Leave a comment:


  • neutral
    replied
    Re: Questions for the christians

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: CEW</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Science has done a tremendous job in explaining what we see around us, but no way can it venture into the realm of the spiritual, e.g. proving the existence or non-existence of heaven and hell, and claim any validity to any of its conclusions. That is why it comes back to what one chooses to believe; not unlike two people looking at the same thing and walking away with two opposite conclusions. One or both of them is/are inevitably wrong, but they can't both be right. </div></div>

    Given all that we <span style="font-weight: bold">do </span> know,and can safely acknowledgeis is possible within the realm of rationality,the existence of a heaven or hell just doesnt fall within that rationality,even a spiritual state of heaven or hell after death,it just seems to be stretching credibility a bit far CEW.

    It still amazes me how so many supposedly intelligent rational people in the world can embrace the concept of heaven or hell,or a &quot;god&quot;,and all the other stuff that comes with the bible and christianity,it just seems crazy that people are prepared to believe so much contradictions,irrationalities,and outward impossible feats,...based on &quot;faith&quot; of the unknown.

    Admittedly I have no quarell with christianity itself,stripped of all its most outrageous concepts,including the virgin birth,its not such a bad thing after all,there`s nothing wrong with some aspects of christian beliefs,...including some aspects of the 10 commandments,its how seemingly sane people are willing to believe such extraordinary stuff in support of &quot;faith&quot;..thats what I find incredible.

    Leave a comment:


  • Diplomat
    replied
    Re: Questions for the christians

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Newtriment</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

    .....<span style="font-weight: bold">there is no scientific evidence to prove that such places exists,or indeed if such a state of mind exists after death. </span></div></div>
    But therein lies the problem. Science is limited to the realm of the natural/material, even though some of the scientific disciplines require a leap of &quot;faith&quot; to embrace concepts that no one has proven. Science has done a tremendous job in explaining what we see around us, but no way can it venture into the realm of the spiritual, e.g. proving the existence or non-existence of heaven and hell, and claim any validity to any of its conclusions. That is why it comes back to what one chooses to believe; not unlike two people looking at the same thing and walking away with two opposite conclusions. One or both of them is/are inevitably wrong, but they can't both be right.

    Leave a comment:


  • neutral
    replied
    Re: Questions for the christians

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TLC_30</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Mawnin Newt....yu gi science and man way too much credit.....big bang theory believer huh?

    Where do you think that knowledge of scientific theories come from?

    Have you ever read revelation?
    </div></div>

    Everything we know is as a result of proven scientific and biological facts,I dont know about a big bang,that theory hasnt been proven beyond doubt,however,the notion that man owes his knowledge to some higher power hasnt been proved either,.....man is still searching for answers about why we are here,and how we came to be,..hence man has created gods in their own image,we are too weak to comprehend a world where there is no higher being to answer to.

    As for revalation,I dont really place much importance on what was written in the bible,the bible is simply a book that was written by man and re-interpreted over the years according to who is doing the interpreting,in my opinion that book is not only outdated and archaic,its ludicrious to read what is written in it and attempt to iterpret it to fit the era we are living in.

    Leave a comment:


  • Shine_Eye_Girl
    replied
    Re: Questions for the christians

    it is too early in the morning for sarcasm....but good morning hun...

    Leave a comment:

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